56 - Shannon Thornton and Strategies to Raise Kids with ADHD 19/08/24

Parents are the primary advocates for their neurodivergent children, and it's essential for them to know and understand their child's unique needs truly! In this episode, Samantha sits down with Shannon Thornton to discuss effective strategies for raising children with ADHD. By knowing their child better and observing the best methods, they can become their child's most significant advocate and ally! Stay tuned!

Here's what to expect on the podcast:

• Some common mistakes Shannon made when first trying to support her neurodivergent children.

• Focusing on a child's executive age rather than their chronological age.

• The social challenges faced by children with ADHD.

• Be mindful of negative comments and feedback, which can significantly impact a child's self-esteem.

• And much more!

About Shannon:

Shannon Thornton is a Licensed Professional Counselor and Certified ADHD Clinical Services Provider through the Institute of Certified ADHD Professionals who Chrysalis Behavioral Therapy and Counseling.

Connect with Shannon Thornton!

Website: https://www.chrysalisbtc.com/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/chrysalisbtc

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/chrysalisbtc

Resources: 

The ADDitude Symptom Checker: https://www.additudemag.com/

CHADD: https://chadd.org/

How to ADHD: https://www.youtube.com/c/howtoadhd

Connect with Samantha Foote!

Website: www.boisemusictherapycompany.com

Email: [email protected]

Consultation: https://letsmeet.io/boisemusictherapycompany/30-mi…

Register for Neurodiversity in Harmony: A Summit for Empowered Parenting: https://www.boisemusictherapycompany.com/register.

TRANSCRIPTION

Are you feeling overwhelmed by your child's unique needs? Wondering how to turn daily challenges into moments of growth? Discover answers at the Neurodiversity in Harmony, a Summit for Empowered Parenting, coming on September 13, 2024. Join us for a day filled with expert insights and real life stories from professionals and parents alike.

All dedicated to autism, ADHD, and other neurodivergent diagnoses. Learn about innovative, positive parenting strategies and gain a deeper understanding of how to support your child's unique journey. Connect with a community that understands and shares your experiences. Whether you're seeking new strategies or some reassurance, this summit is your gateway to an empowered parenting approach.

Seats are limited, so don't miss out. Join our waitlist now to receive exclusive updates and registration details, visit www. boisimusictherapycompany. com today to secure your spot. Embrace the journey of neurodiverse parenting with us. This podcast is for parents like you navigating the world of neurodiversity with love and compassion.

I'm a neurodivergent mother of three amazing neurodivergent children and a board certified music therapist. Our mission is to create a supportive space. where you feel understood, connected, and inspired with practical tips, strategies, and resources will help you and your child thrive in your unique way.

Join us as we dive deep into the diverse world of neurodivergent individuals exploring topics like ADHD, Autism, dyslexia, sensory processing challenges, and more. We'll cover it all to empower, educate, and uplift both neurodivergent individuals and those who walk alongside them. Together, we'll create a world where every brain is valued and celebrated.

We're excited to embark on this enlightening journey with you. We are your hosts, Samantha Foote and Lauren Ross, and this is the Every Brain is Different podcast.

Welcome to the Every Brain is Different podcast. You're here with Shannon Thornton. And she is the owner of Chrysalis Behavioral Therapy and Counseling. She is a licensed professional counselor and certified ADHD clinical services provider through the Institute of Certified ADHD Professionals. Shannon, we are so excited to have you on the show.

Thanks for coming on. Thank you. I'm excited to be here. Thanks. Can you tell us a little bit more about how you're involved in the neurodivergent community? Sure. I'd love to. Uh, when I started my practice, I was trying to develop a special niche because I didn't want to just be a general practitioner and because my husband and both children have ADHD and they're so different and my husband and I made so many mistakes.

I felt like raising them as neurotypical kids. That I realized, wow, what an opportunity opportunity I have now to help other people not have to deal with the stuff that we did and make the same mistakes we did. So I got extra training in that and I use my practice to help other people with this. Yeah, that's awesome.

That's kind of what I do, too. Like, I just want to help parents going through the early stages of getting the autism diagnosis or the other neurodivergent diagnoses and just teaching them things I've learned because all three of my kids, you know, are neurodivergent and so I definitely made mistakes that if they I wish I could have known better to do better.

Yes. So yes, I understand that. Um, can you tell us a little bit more about your journey? Like, um, how long you've been practicing, um, and stuff like that? Sure. I stayed home to raise the kids. I had a corporate job, um, in a big insurance company a long, long time ago, and I did personal and professional development training.

So I've always loved to teach and to learn and to help other people. So after my kids got older, I got certified in practical parent education and started Thornton Training Group, and that was to help parents at Like moms groups, PTAs, church groups, things like that. And teach them a curriculum that had already been established.

And eventually I got to a point where I really wanted to have more credentials and learn more information and help at a, on a broader level. So I went back to school when I was 40 and got my master's. And, um, my first degree was in business, so completely different direction. And, um, I've been in practice now for a little over 10 years.

Nice. I, um, how we got introduced was I was talking to another parent in Idaho. That she had her son and she went to you for counseling with her son and she just raves about you. She's like, you have to meet her. And so she raves about you. So that's awesome. But, um, can you tell us some strategies that maybe parents can use when raising ADHD kids?

Wow. That's a very open ended question. Yeah. Um, My first step would be to recognize that you are the parent. And you're the one that's going to have to change. Okay. When I was raising my kids, I remember I had my daughter in therapy. She was like five or six. And I was like, you've got to fix this kid. I can't control her.

She's not responding to anything. She's so strong willed. And she's like, okay, here's some behavioral changes you can make blah, blah, blah. And I got angry. And I was like, she's the one that's a problem. Yeah. It's her, you know, and she's like, she took over the therapist, took her glasses off, she leaned over the table and she said, You have to do it, Shannon, because you're the adult.

You know, that killed me. But what I, what I learned there was that children, until they're a certain age, usually around 14 or 15, um, only have concrete thought. They don't have the ability to look inside themselves, recognize how their behaviors affect other people. So, I was in charge, my husband and I were in charge of creating an environment that our children could thrive in given the brain that they were working with.

So learning that was the first thing. Um, second thing would be learning everything I could about how to parent a child with ADHD and understanding that, um, there are going to be a lot of different levels of independence that they're three to five years behind in their executive function abilities in that frontal lobe development.

And they might be great at one thing. Just way behind on something else. So saying, well, you can do this. So you should be able to do that big mistake or gosh, you're 10 years old. You should be able to fill in the blank. We need to look at our kids, um, as their executive age and not their chronological age.

So those are some really major things that I, that I took away from. Yeah. I love what you said about changing yourself because. Children often, they don't have the capability of self regulation without the co regulation with their parent. So if you're not self regulating yourself, then your child is definitely going to escalate.

If you're escalating, they're going to escalate. But if you can learn to do self regulation for yourself, then you can co regulate with them and so you can bring them down and then you're able to solve the problem. And then I heard this. Thing the other day that was just, it makes sense, but it just was surprising to me that when kids go through puberty, their brains are like.

Toddlers again, they don't have the capacity to like reign in their emotions. So they said that the brain is like developing at such a rapid rate, you know, when you're a toddler, and then again, when you're going through puberty, that it's just changing so much that you can't really like. Regulate your emotions because you're just going through all this change and your body can't really handle it.

And so I think it's so important for parents to realize that when they're, when their kids are going through puberty, that they needed, they don't need to treat them like a toddler, but they need to remember that they have like the toddler ability to control their emotions. And if you can co regulate with them, then that can bring them down and then they're able to talk.

And then if they are having a meltdown, use less words, don't sit there and be like, you need to calm down. Cause never in the history of you need to calm down. Has anyone actually calmed down first of all, and second of all, they're, they're not processing what you're saying. They're just. Having a meltdown, they're not going to understand what you're saying to them.

So I love, yeah, I just love that you said you need to change yourself, work on yourself and ADHD is not something that needs fixed. It needs something that needs to be supported. Yes. And adjusted. And you're right. The fixed word is, is something that I think really goes back to a parent's expectation and.

Honestly, and I don't know if you went through this yourself, Samantha, but there is a grieving process that as parents we go through when our children are not at the same rate of development as other children. We get frustrated, we're upset for them, why it's very isolating, why am I the only one who feels this way, why am I the only one whose kid is acting this way.

And so there's some grief that goes through there too. So monitoring our own expectations on what we can handle, what our child is able to handle, we have to regulate that on our own. And, um, mentioning, you know, not, not escalating them is, Kids with ADHD oftentimes start arguments and start problems because their brains, in the front of their brains, there's just not enough activity going on.

So they're, they're seeking external stimulation. And oftentimes it looks like, why do you constantly bother me? Why are you constantly getting in my space or bother your brother or whatever? And, um, they, they, they need that. So when they start an argument, they're looking for us to argue back and we do because we're human and they just love it.

They don't, on the surface, they don't love it because they're in trouble, but their brain loves the stimulation. So the calmer we stay, the more we can validate their feelings, but not get sucked in to that vortex, the better. Yeah, that is so good to realize. Cause I know. I was reading this thing about people with ADHD and they thrive in chaos, but when things are calm, they need the dopamine hit.

They like, that's when they get anxiety or whatever, because they're not, they're not in chaos and their mind thrives in chaos. So that totally makes sense that they would start arguments so that they get in that chaos and they might get in trouble, but it's making their brain happy. That's funny. Yeah.

That is so interesting. Yeah. They don't get it though. And you can't explain it to them when they're super young. And even, even when they're much older, they're like, that's ridiculous, mom. You don't know anything, but that's, I mean, neurobiologically that's what's happening. It's fascinating. That is so good to know.

And it makes sense. Like my kids will just start fights with each other just out of nowhere. And I'm like, what are you doing? Cause they'll be perfectly calm. And then all of a sudden. They'll just like, my daughter will just run in and like tackle one of my boys. And I just, I just said, what, what are you doing?

Why? I don't know. It just felt like a good thing to do. And she was like starting the drama, you know? And oh my gosh, that makes me think of something. The I don't know, they don't ever ask a kid with ADHD. Why did you do this? Why can't you remember your pencil? Why did you do whatever silly thing you did?

Because they don't know. Yeah. They are not being driven by their, the logical, um, planning part of their brain. They're just reacting and doing whatever they need to do impulsively in the moment. And they honestly don't know. So there's no point in asking. But you'll have the answer. Yeah. And I've noticed that with my own kids.

And then it was so funny. Last weekend I was at the cabin, my in laws cabin with their whole family was there. And my nephew, he's six years old and he is a compulsive liar. So he comes into the cabin, he gets a cup out and then he's like, I need a drink. And I said, well, where's the cup I just gave you five minutes ago that you went outside with?

And he's like, this is it. I said, no, I just saw you get that cup out of the drawer. No, no, this is my cup. And he was adamant that that was his cup. And then I said, I understand what you're doing. I. Need you to go get the cup that I gave you because we're not dirtying more cups, you know, and he's like, oh, fine.

So he goes outside, gets a cup, comes back inside and gives it to me and it's all dirty. So I get him a new cup anyway, but then I said, Hey, why, why do you lie when it's very obvious that you're lying? And he just like his shoulders slumped down and he just said, I don't know. I'll put a little show on. Yes, but it's just so true.

Like he has no idea why he's doing it. I think he's doing it just for the attention and getting that like dopamine hit that Hey, someone's talking to me, even though I'm getting in trouble, but someone's paying attention to me, you know? Yep. So, yep. And you know, you bring up a really good point. I read a study once that children with ADHD received, um, so many more negative comments during the day than a neurotypical child does.

It's with my daughter, it used to be, why did you bring him and Sharpies to math class? Well, I thought it'd be prettier that way. No, we don't do that. Why would you draw a picture of a dragon for me when we are in whatever class? I don't know. And where, where's your notebook? Why did you leave it behind?

And. You're so annoying. Leave me alone. Why are you so weird? All this? They just get all these comments all day long. And so they're walking around with this heaviness and it really can affect their self esteem. And the study said that for every um, one negative comment or feedback that a child receives, they need nine at a boys.

From a parent or a child or whatever, um, to kind of negate them. And that's not going to happen. Cause I remember my, my therapist used to say, you need to find her doing something right. And I'm like, okay, I'm working really hard right now, but everything is chaos. So we have to be really mindful of, of the words we speak into our kids as well.

Yes, absolutely. I know when I was a kid, everyone called me overdramatic, and I talked too much, I talked too fast, I was annoying, and I internalized that, and I just kept that my whole life. And so as I got older, I tried to hide my emotions, and that definitely did not work. And I just try not to talk as much.

And people are like, well, why don't you talk anymore? And I'm like, what do you want from me? No, I'm talking too much. Not talking enough. What do you want for me? And then it like, it goes into other things like food, for example, I just. I'm hiding other things in my life. And so I like, I read this study that.

This is a thing that like you overeat because you're looking for the dopamine hit if you're like hiding You're masking other things in your life then you're gonna like Use food as that. And so now I'm like, well, now I'm eating too much and now I'm doing this and nothing's right. And so it is true. Like you definitely internalize the negative things where people praise me my whole life for like, Oh, my hair is so beautiful.

And I play the piano so well, and I get really good grades and everyone praised me for that. But all I remember was you're annoying because you talk too much. Yes. And it sticks, doesn't it? Yeah. Yeah. And then I'm like, well, maybe, and they said that also neurodivergent people lose friends and they don't know why.

Yeah. And so I think that's really important as a teenager, especially for kids to understand that, you know, they might lose friends, but it's not their fault most of the time. And so, but I just read this thing that a lot of neurodivergent people, maybe because of like the rejection sensitivity dysphoria that you just think.

That no one likes you. So then you act like no one likes you. So then you're not really friends with them. I don't know what it is, but, um, I just remember I did lose a lot of friends in high school and I had no idea why, but looking back on it, I wasn't engaging with them, like they were engaging with each other because I was like, well, they're just my friends just to make me feel good.

And so I don't know, I think. Teenagers, especially just, we need to teach them more things about ADHD. Yes. And it's, it's so, it's such a frustrating, um, mental wiring, I guess, because so your executive functions in the front of your brain, one of them is self awareness, like we talked about, um, but so, but if I'm not self aware of what I'm doing, that's annoying you, or if my self esteem is down, but I'm not able to be aware of that.

have better self talk for myself. Um, I'm going to have a hard time getting along with people or like my kids had a great, they were, it was really easy for them to find and make friends because they were the fun ones and they were silly and they were attractive to people, but then they As they, when they were younger, things were fine, but their friends kept maturing in my kids stayed at a lower maturity level.

So things that weren't funny anymore, we're still finding to my kids or my daughter wanted to make us a scavenger hunt. And her friend was like, there aren't really pirates, you know, whatever it was. Um, they, they recognize that people are, are maturing away from them. And they don't know how to respond to them anymore.

And it's, it's awful because now at that point they get it. They're like, I'm different. I know they say I'm annoying. I'm not sure what I'm doing. That's annoying. It's, it's really hard. Yeah. Yeah. Do you have any strategies for how to navigate that with kids? Like how to explain it to them or just how to help them?

The, the thing that I just learned recently in a class, if you will, that I was taking was that the social skills groups. That are usually, um, like, recommended to these kids aren't as helpful as they thought they were. Because the kids have a hard time transferring what they learn in the social skills group to a real life event.

Like their brain just goes, and they can't. figure out what to say next, so it's really not very helpful. There used to be a commercial about a cereal, and I think it was Life cereal, and the little boys were like, I don't want to try it, do you want to try it? They're like, no, but Mikey will try it. Mikey eats anything.

And Mikey was like the little brother, so Mikey would do anything you told him to. Don't be Mikey. Because the kids with ADHD are usually the ones who are risk takers, driven by impulse, want to make friends, their friends are laughing, so I'm going to do it. And they get themselves hurt because they're trying to be liked.

So also knowing when you're following the crowd, is everyone else doing this or am I the only one who's been asked to put the exam on the teacher's desk or whatever? Those are the things to really pay attention to. Yeah, that's smart, especially in dangerous situations or situations where you might get in trouble, you know, at school or with the law or whatever, that are my, the only one that they're asking to do this.

So yeah, when I was younger, I did things because I was so afraid of everything. I didn't know what was truly like dangerous. And there were some things that I did that I was like, wow, I probably shouldn't have done that. But I was so afraid of things. I'm like, well, If that, if they're asking me to do it, or if they're doing it, then it must be safe.

You know, cause I just, I did not understand what was safe and what was not safe. Um, so yeah, those are really good points. Thank you. Sure. That must have been really hard to discern. How do I make a good decision here? Yeah. Yeah. I, I, it was really hard for me. Like, I was just like, well, if they're doing it, then I guess I should do it.

Cause I was trying to fit in, but then, but then they would ask me to do things that like not everyone was doing. But I just wanted to be liked and so I'm like, well, I'll do it because I just want to fit in, you know, so are there any other tips or anything that you have for parents or even other people with ADHD that are listening to this?

Oh my goodness, the tips and tricks to go on and on. Yeah. But I would think some of my favorites would be routines, which people with ADHD say, yeah, routines aren't fun. I want to be just spontaneous. But. Because their brains are driven by whatever is in front of them instead of what needs to be done.

They tend to get behind. They're late. They have poor time management skills. They forget about things. So I would ask, is there a rule or routine I can put in place to make this easier? Uh, can I put my medicine by my toothbrush? If I brush my teeth every morning and I take my meds in the morning, then I'll see it and I'll go, I'll take my meds in the morning.

I can take it. Using audio reminders, visual cues, lists, but those things that you can engage with, like turn off the reminder, check off the list so that you don't just see it and keep going, that you interact with the reminder. Um, maybe if they're in school, they have a list in their locker. Uh, these are the things that I need to take home every day.

Or whatever. Um, so those are some tips and tricks I would definitely encourage parents to have very clear expectations with their children, because with a neurotypical child, you could just holler and say, Hey, I'm picking you up at four o'clock today, instead of four 30. Okay. And that kid would probably remember neurodivergent children.

It's real important to say, Hey, and like, kind of get their head in your hands, get on their level, their height level. Okay. And say, Hey, I need to tell you something important. Are you listening? Yes. Okay. Hey, I'm going to pick you up at four o'clock today, not four 30. Okay. Yes. Now, what did I say? You're going to pick me up at four o'clock.

Okay. So what's happening at four, kind of go back and forth because you need to make it stick. And if they can repeat it, um, that's real helpful. Yeah. What else? A launching pad is helpful that you work from every day. My backpack goes here, my lunch box goes here, my keys, my wallet go there. So there's no losing of things constantly having a place for that.

Yeah. That's super important. I know I should do that with my husband, the, um, repeating things because I'll be like, we're going to go here at four o'clock. And he's like, okay, I'll be there at four 15. That's super important. No, that's not what I said. Um, what did I say? 3. 45. No, we're going here for, okay, I'll be there at four, and then he writes it down.

Um, so, yeah. That's the same conversation with my boyfriend this morning. I was like, listen, I was like, you're going to Costco's today, you're getting snacks for the road trip, and I need you to do the laundry. Got it? Yeah, so I went and did a couple of things, and then I was like, What did I ask you to do today?

Yes. Like oco, snacks, laundry. And I'm like, cool, thanks. And then I asked one more time right before I walked out the door. Isn't that nuts? You do. You like, did it really ? Stay in those forehead. And I do the same thing with my boys. I'm just like, okay, I need you to listen right now. And I don't make them make eye contact with me, but I make them listen, you know?

Mm-Hmm. . And so then I'll say. What did I say? And they'll repeat it back to me. And if they repeat it back to me and it's wrong, I'm like, well, let's listen again. This is what I'm saying. And then they repeat it back to me. And then we do it one more time. Just to make sure it sticks. So yeah, those are great suggestions.

Um, I could talk to you all day about this. So do you have any suggestions for resources or do you have resources yourself that people can get? Well, as parents, I would say my, there are so many things out there right now. So any information you could read the better, um, I like attitude mag. com. And it's not ATT, like, like I have an attitude.

It's A D D I T D attitude mag, like magazine. com. That's a wonderful resource online to go to. Another great online resource is chad.org. It's children and adults with A DHD, so it's ch ad.org and they have a lot of wonderful resources and they connect you with people and professionals in your area that understand A DHD.

If you go to my website, uh, there's an events tab and I've got a lot of recordings on there that folks can listen to. And they can even read some things on, on my website. I don't think I have a lot of tips and tricks on there, but, uh, the webinars I think are real helpful. Cause I do a lot of public speaking things on ADHD.

Um, trying to think there's a lot of good podcasts. Yeah. And my favorite YouTube for ADHD is called how to ADHD. And there's a young woman who has ADHD and. She's like, hello brains. And so she, she's really cute and animated and really understands every facet of ADHD and makes it really, uh, easier to understand and relate.

So yeah, I'll look at those places. Yeah. Those are great resources. I love it. Uh, where can people find you online if they want to find you? Yes. I am at www. chrysalisbtc. com. It's Chrysalis Behavioral Therapy and Counseling. That's the btc. com and all my contact information is there. I'm also on Facebook, um, Chrysalis Behavioral Therapy and Counseling and Instagram is chrysalisbtc.

Awesome. Thank you. Yeah. Well, thank you. Oh, our last question. What do you do for fun? What do I do for fun? I love going to the movies. I love being outdoors grounding is one of my favorite things to do. And that is just putting my feet in the grass and being outside in nature, going on hikes, swimming. Um, I love to work out and I love to cook.

Awesome. We should be friends if you didn't live in Texas. Well, you can at least do those things for most of the year that I'm stuck inside because it's so hot. Yeah. Yeah, that's true. Yeah. Except right now the heat wave is killing me, man. It's like 107 here. I'm like, what is happening? People move there to get away from this weather.

Yeah. It's crazy. But, um, but yes. Thank you. Uh, thank you so much for coming on the show. We really appreciate your time. I loved it. I could talk about it all day. It's so great to talk with you today. Thanks. Okay. Well, she was fantastic. I loved it. And I loved her Texas accent. I know. So she is actually going to be at our summit in September.

She's going to be one of the presenters. And I'm really excited to hear what she's going to have to say she's going to give a five minute presentation and then she's going to lead a 20 minute. Um, group where people can just ask her questions, just pick her brain for 20 minutes. And then she'll also be doing a 20 minute presentation that people can watch before or after the summit.

So I'm super excited for her to be there. So what did you think of what she said today? Um, I took so many notes because I loved everything. Yeah. Um, but, uh, lots of things, um, When we, you guys talked about it, change, we have to change ourselves. Um, I, I teach that at my job. We don't change people. We teach people and we do that by changing ourselves in order to be successful with them.

Um, and so I, that's really, really important. Um, and again, reminder that they are children. They are not small adults. And so they do not have the. capacity, um, and the knowledge to, to do the things we think and want them to be doing. Um, another thing that kind of stood out to me and is just how We have expectations and we think our kids should be doing something or like, um, and, and especially kids with ADHD are like, why did you do that?

Why are you doing it this way? When we use language like that, and all of that, we instill learned helplessness into these children, which then again, causes. challenging behaviors later, um, and stuff that they have to work through later. And, and so again, just being mindful of our language with our children so that we're not inadvertently instilling that learned helpless in them, um, that they can't do things that they're terrible and annoying and whatever else it is.

Um, something else that she mentioned, um, that I think does not get talked about enough, um, and that's This may be something that maybe we dive a little bit deeper in the future. Um, but that grief that parents do go through when they find out their child has, um, a diagnosis or something that will impact their life in a way, like they're not going to be doing things, especially, you know, the children that are more severe, uh, with some of these disabilities and stuff, like.

It's a legit grieving process because they lost all of these ideas that they had for their children in their future. Um, and I think like we don't think about that enough and we don't acknowledge it enough. I don't feel anyways. And so, um, I'm glad that she kind of brought that up because it's a good reminder that parents do.

It's grief and you're allowed to feel that and you should and it's okay. Yeah. Uh, I, uh, some, uh, stuck out, uh, with the ADHD adults in my life, um, that, that, that need for stimulation, um, it kind of hit home, but, uh, because my boyfriend's trying to like switch up some of the things going on in his life and I'm like, it's finally calm and like you're less stressed and all this stuff.

And it's because he's not stimulated. Like he needs that even though it stresses him out and it's chaotic, like that stimulation is needed. And I have. Another coworker seemed like she thrives in chaos. Um, and, uh, like for me as someone who doesn't necessarily have that, I'm like watching, I'm just like, does it make sense why you would want to be in that, but it's what the brain needs and they're going to find a way to, you know, tickle the brain in that area, which I think is, is interesting and it's challenging for us to kind of accept.

Um, when, like, that's kind of what our loved ones are going through and doing, uh, because it, it just doesn't make sense to us. Uh, so, um, I think those were my big ones. Yeah. I just want to say a couple things from what you said, the last one that you said about I was looking at myself and how I always seem to get to a calm place in my life.

And then I have to do something that creates the chaos or the challenge. So I finally got to a place in my business where music therapy was running great. It was profitable. Everything was great, but I was so bored with my business. And so I'm like, well, now I have to do something else. And so I opened behavioral therapy and that's running great.

And then I was like, well, now I have to do something else. So now I'm like doing parent coaching and it's not. As successful as the other things, because I've only been doing it for, you know, I've been doing parent education for like 11 year or 13 years, but I haven't done just specifically that without the other services.

And so that's my challenge right now. And I'm like, it's funny because my grandma was a serial entrepreneur and I'm like, why didn't I do it? She just stick with one business once it became profitable because she would start a business, it would become profitable, she'd sell it or, or just close it and then she would open another business and suffer through it and then it got profitable and then she would sell it or get rid of it.

And I'm like, why do you do that? And then I realized I'm doing the same exact thing. I know, and I, I watch you, like, like, I see you, like, always doing something new and new, and I'm like, how does she find time? Like, how is she not, and it's like, that's where you thrive, and it doesn't make sense to us outsiders, for like, stressful, like, why are you putting yourself through that?

But, and again, the same thing with my, my coworker, my boyfriend, I'm just like, Why? And, but it's them and that's what they need and that's what they need to be happy sometimes too, even though it sometimes can cause unhappy happiness. Um, and so it's just, it's very interesting. And then especially like, again, when you don't have it and you're watching, it's like, Make it make sense, right?

Yeah. Yeah. It's very interesting. Yeah. It's just, it's weird. I don't know why, like she said, I don't know why I do what I do. I just do it because that's what makes my brain happy. So punishment is how it's true. Um, the other thing that you're talking about was the grieving process, which I agree. We don't talk enough about that.

And it's not just like your kid gets a diagnosis and you grieve because when my kids got their diagnoses, I didn't grieve. I was like, okay, this is what it is. You know, it's fine. And then as they get older though, and I see their struggles and I see what I thought they would do and they're not doing it.

Like, that's all on me. There's nothing wrong with them. But that's just my vision of what I thought would happen. Would bring them happiness is not bringing them happiness. And what brought me happiness and what I was so excited to share with them, they, they have no interest in. And I think that's the hardest part is I want them to participate in things.

It brought me so much joy, but it doesn't bring them joy. And I have to respect that, but I also grieve that because I was so excited to share that with them. Yeah, and again, and, and like you said, like, it's not just the initial, like it can be lifelong, like depending on what the situation is when they're an adult and, you know, all of these other people are doing this and getting married.

It's like my child potentially might never get married and like things like that, like it can last a long time, um, in, in these spurts of, you know, typical milestones and, and things for people. And so like, that's hard. Yeah, yeah, it's remembering to acknowledge that I think especially this part. Yeah, for sure.

Well, I Really liked having her on the show. I thought she had some really good advice some strategies for parents if you want to see her At the summit, we will have the link for the waitlist to get on the waitlist in our show notes, and you can check that out. We will start registering people for it in August, and then the summit itself is on September 13th, so if anyone is interested, they can check it out there.

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